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 Post subject: Re: Amiga Stones 'n Bones remake
 Post Posted: Fri Dec 27, 2013 4:17 am 
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Joined: Fri Jul 02, 2010 4:32 am
Posts: 1632
Wow, really great job - I love the graphics and the layout seems to be perfect!

We have done speed devils with LvR (another one of the series), but I don't have your skills for graphics (Steve has done the graphics of the special edition). If you want to take some things in the script, go for it - LvR is a full time programmer (and a good one) - there are some interesting things in it (the DMD for example).

That was fun times, hope you enjoyed to work on this as we have on ours ;)

Little tips (if you haven't already done that), record to disk when you are playing with winuae (or dosbox) - it's quite easy to understand how the points are counted and to grab the dmd (LvR redrawn the DMD from the video if I remember correctly).

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 Post subject: Re: Amiga Stones 'n Bones remake
 Post Posted: Fri Dec 27, 2013 8:06 am 
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Joined: Sat Feb 04, 2012 10:16 am
Posts: 746
Danke dir für die Bilder ein Amiga Pinball Klasse :)

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 Post subject: Re: Amiga Stones 'n Bones remake
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 28, 2013 7:19 am 
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Joined: Mon Mar 26, 2012 5:42 am
Posts: 26
Location: Germany
Hi,
very good start!!! I am one of the biggest Fan of Amiga-tables (look at the tables we've created) ;)
That's why I only have to say: go on this way!
Question: where you come from...what's your Homeland?

Greetings Jerry

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Tables I have created in cooperation with Sebek74 and Slash2084:
BILLION DOLLAR GAMESHOW, PSYCHO WILD WEST, NIGHTMARE, PSYCHO TRICK OR TREAT
WIP: ??? No Programmer by my side... :-(


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 Post subject: Re: Amiga Stones 'n Bones remake
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 28, 2013 1:56 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 26, 2013 1:32 am
Posts: 14
Hello all, I am in the northeast US, and the Amiga was part of my younger years. I got the newest version of WinUAE, which I like very much, and found out that my collection of ADF's did not include Pinball Fantasies for some reason, but did include Pinball Dreams. So, I had to go looking for Fantasies, which I found. I also found the manual for the game, which explains the major scoring outline for each table pretty well as far as scoring modes and such. Only thing after that is minor scoring specifics, which shouldn't be too hard since I've recorded a gameplay video for reference.

So, there are a few major things that need to be done before really getting into the programming part. I will be starting with the ECS version. The bumpers need to be made to look accurate as far as color scheme, and how to light them up and look good when they are activated. That's another thing: good-looking lighting all around. The screams ramp needs to be determined if it works well or not consistently enough. Like I said, it works, but only about 80% of the time. However, I won't let that hold me back. If need be, I'll put the table out as it is and it can be dealt with later. Other people might have ideas to make it work more consistently, so that shouldn't hold back progress on the rest of the table. And other than that, table graphics, which will be important. Slowly but surely, it will get there.

Oh, a couple things about table design, now that they just sprung to me. In the manuals for the game, they mention shooting the "clear ramp" as combo's to activate various scoring modes. I can only assume they mean the large overhead criss-cross ramp with the gold wire side guides, which, by the original table graphics, I always assumed it was supposed to be some sort of metal mesh grid. I never knew it was meant to be taken as "clear"! It makes sense though, since they couldn't do a lot with transparency they had to settle with a dither pattern to still be able to see through it. I have grown fond of my metal-mesh style for that ramp, though, so I wonder if the fans think it should be made into a real partially-transparent kind of solid plastic? If you think that's the end-all best way it should be for accuracy to the original, then I will for sure do it. I probably will anyway, eventually, but I'll have to say goodbye to what I thought was my solution to the grid pattern in the original game. Sad face. LOL

The other part is the kickback. I never understood how it was supposed to work. You activate it on the RIP ramp, but you can still lose the ball down the left outlane. I thought it was supposed to save the ball (once) down that outlane if it was activated, but I could swear I've seen the ball drain when the kickback was activated. Otherwise, you can get into it (the kickback) from the RIP ramp, but you can always do that, and get the vault treasure. So, it seemed like it never worked as expected. So my idea is that it will work once as a ball save down that outlane, until it is activated again. Any ideas on these topics, feel free to say.


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 Post subject: Re: Amiga Stones 'n Bones remake
 Post Posted: Sun Dec 29, 2013 8:23 am 
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Joined: Sun May 08, 2011 4:57 pm
Posts: 1063
Location: Turin-ITALY
Compared to the version of "Light 86", this seems to have a very good graphics. Also I have started with Super Android (Epic) ...... I grew up with pinball for pc, less with the pinball arcade game....
Best wishes and welcome from us.


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 Post subject: Re: Amiga Stones 'n Bones remake
 Post Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 2:47 am 
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Joined: Thu Dec 26, 2013 1:32 am
Posts: 14
Hello all, progress is made. Did a little bit of everything: graphics, programming, DMD. I also encountered the dreaded "black text color" glitch. I hope none of you have encountered that, because it's near impossible to recover from unless you have a prior save. Luckily, I've been pretty disciplined about diligent saving. I'll make the smallest of changes and save a new file. I'm already up to 050 from 000.

Nalex, when I first started this a couple years ago, I went gang-busters on every detail I could to get it to match at least the looks of the original. It was fun, as I was also just discovering Future Pinball at the time. I didn't know you did a Speed Devils table, but I would like to check it out, especially if I can learn any tips from your programmer in the code. Also, I did manage to get some gameplay of the original recorded, and it does help a lot.

I got a good deal of DMD programming done, mainly cosmetic stuff like text scrolls during attract mode. I've been working on the DMD as located on the back wall, as you can see in a couple of the screenshots from before. It's the only place I could really put it other than just behind the flippers, as you can see in the other screenshot. I had to use the 192x64 DMD because the DMD in the original game is 160 wide, if I remember right, and the only other options in FP are 128 wide. So, with some trickery, I'm using the 192x64 and masking out (covering) the parts that aren't needed to make it 160x16, as the original. The only thing is location. It works well visually on the back wall, but the reason I think I moved it from there is because of the distance from the flippers, you don't see the actual dot matrix, but a rather distorted version of it because of the graphics card's interpolation of pixels or mipmapping, whatever causes it. It doesn't look stellar, but it's a decent location for gameplay. But we can worry about that later, after it's at least programmed.

There is not a lot to show graphically, although I did manage to get another monster made (red demon), which is a big deal since the last 3 were the hardest to get a handle on. The biggest of course is still the reaper, and that one's yet to come.

Just an update, sorry to keep flooding the board. Other people are doing work on their (professional) tables and I keep jumping my post to the top. I'll try to keep posts to once or twice a week, or 2 weeks, unless there is a major progress or problem encountered. Thanks for the support, guys!


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 Post subject: Re: Amiga Stones 'n Bones remake
 Post Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 8:51 am 
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Joined: Sat Jul 17, 2010 2:15 am
Posts: 976
Looks like some pretty detailed work. The use of 192x64 DMD will mean PinDMD users won't be able to play this table with a real DMD (limited to 132 wide) but I don't think you have much choice when trying to emulate this table's DMD.

Keep up the great work!


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 Post subject: Re: Amiga Stones 'n Bones remake
 Post Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 12:11 pm 
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Joined: Fri Apr 05, 2013 2:33 pm
Posts: 146
Location: Brazil
Xigmatek wrote:
I also encountered the dreaded "black text color" glitch. I hope none of you have encountered that, because it's near impossible to recover from unless you have a prior save.


Hello, Xigmatek.

Sorry if I'm wrong but do you mean the loading screen text turning to black and not allowing you to change color again ?

I have the same problem often, this is what I do:

- Close FP

- Open FP and load your table

- Select Table >> Table info... menu option

- Choose the text color you want

- Save table and exit FP

Now run your table again and check if the color was saved correctly.


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 Post subject: Re: Amiga Stones 'n Bones remake
 Post Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 12:52 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 26, 2013 1:32 am
Posts: 14
tio_italo, yes, that is the problem I was referring to. However, I did not know that it could be overcome many times over, thanks for the tip. It was my understanding that you could fix the problem once if you had to, but after that you should never go into Table Info again or else it would come back and stay. But it can be done as many times as necessary? The key to it must be that the table not containing the error is loaded, the one change is made and saved, and the program is exited. I must have thought it was so bad because I probably discovered it on a save file which already had the problem in place, and couldn't get rid of it, so I had to go back a couple of saves. Well, thanks for the tip, I didn't know it could be overcome as many times as needed!


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 Post subject: Re: Amiga Stones 'n Bones remake
 Post Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 1:58 pm 
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Joined: Tue Mar 19, 2013 3:21 pm
Posts: 147
tio_italo wrote:
I have the same problem often, this is what I do:

- Close FP

- Open FP and load your table

- Select Table >> Table info... menu option

- Choose the text color you want

- Save table and exit FP

Now run your table again and check if the color was saved correctly.


Sadly this method does not work for me :-(

I am yet to find a way to fix the problem, any table i edit the info of seems to do this!
If i find another fix i'll let you know

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